"Let’s try to break these patterns." A conversation with Alex Dzurko about more than just covering up Nazi tattoos.

Artist and tattooist Alex Dzurko explores Romani identity, history, and memory in his work. His exhibition When Numbers Cry commemorates the fates of Romani victims of Nazism and opens a dialogue on why it is important not to forget. In this interview, published on the occasion of Romani Holocaust Memorial Day on August 2nd, he discusses, among other things, how he has been successfully bridging ideological divides since his school years.

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Would you call yourself an activist?

Whether I’m an activist… I don’t really see myself that way, although through my art, you could say that I am.

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What was your path to raising awareness about Romani history?

 One moment was actually the most important. We were watching documentaries about Auschwitz, and there was almost no mention of the Roma in them. That was during a period when I wanted to draw something, not from a reference, but from my head. It all clicked, and I drew my first painting. I just realized that this is what I wanted to draw. It was only over time that it turned into a whole project.

Was the Romani Holocaust something that was talked about in your family or among your peers?

We do talk about these things in my family sometimes. My grandmother used to tell stories about how her mother was running from the Germans when she was little and lost her shoes in the woods. My grandmother would always cry when she told it. And my friends sometimes stop me and say they follow my work and are actually glad I’m doing this. I often don’t even know that they were or are interested in such things. Because for us Roma, it’s not just easy to say, for example, that you’re watching a documentary. You’d immediately hear: “Hey, what are you acting like a gadjo for?” Maybe not so much now, but definitely a few years ago. But when one person shows that it’s not something to be ashamed of to be interested in these things, others might join in too.

How did you start covering up tattooed Nazi symbols?

I saw a video on Facebook about ten years ago where someone was doing this. When I started tattooing, it came back to me. While I was still living with my mom, I didn't want to bring those kinds of people around, but once I had my own place, I decided to give it a try. At the time, I had no idea how big of a deal it would become. Then a taxi driver from Teplice named Tomáš wrote to me, saying he’d seen my call to action. He talked about how he wasn't just doing it because he couldn't wear a tank top in public, but because he wanted to get rid of it since his mindset had completely changed. I started to see it as doing a good deed—breaking the system a little bit and making it possible for us to talk to each other. Then there was another guy who claimed he wasn't a Nazi, just that he liked the ideology, which of course doesn't make much sense. And then there was a kid from Prague who talked about how he couldn't fit in anywhere, and that’s just how it happened. Now he hangs out with Roma people and is totally fine. He admitted it was a stupid mistake.

It’s actually quite admirable that you choose to give a second chance to people who were previously capable of spreading hate in such a way.

Back in trade school, I sat at a desk next to a skinhead. I remember a teacher coming into the classroom—who was a racist himself—and saying, "How strange, a Gypsy and a skinhead sitting next to each other." I just enjoyed disrupting that. I always say, "Let’s try to break these patterns if we can."

Do you feel like you’re able to understand them in some way?

I can’t understand why someone who wants to fit in would choose to join the Nazis. I struggled to fit in too, but it would never have occurred to me to start hating people because of it. I’ve been beaten up by Roma people, and I’m not a Nazi. Skinheads used to chase me around Teplice—there would be like fifteen of them and only two of us. But I still won’t start lumping everyone into one group and judging them.

How is the exhibition going? Are you managing to attract a non-Roma audience as well?

Yeah, non-Roma people come too. I’ve often noticed that even non-Roma people have cried at the exhibition. I’m really glad for that because it shows me that they care.

You’ve already taken part in a memorial ceremony in Auschwitz. Will you be there again this year on August 2nd?

Yes, I will. In cooperation with Slovo 21, we’ve organized a bus. Ten adults and ten children are going. We’ll attend the memorial ceremony and then go for a tour. I wanted to show it to the kids and to people who haven’t been there before. I’m curious to see how it will be, because it’s just so incredibly sad.

Is there anything else you’re working on right now?

I’m working on a film at the moment. I’m using AI to animate my drawings. It’s going to be a short film, but it should be finished by next year. I’d like to hold the premiere in Teplice, and most importantly, I want to get it into schools.

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